[CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
260 messages Options
12345678 ... 13
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Y2K not - Re: Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Robert Moskowitz

On 07/08/2014 01:45 PM, Les Mikesell wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 12:22 PM, Gilbert Sebenste
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On Tue, 8 Jul 2014, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
>>
>>> and did the conversion for display to save another byte.  Efficiency?
>>> We were desperate for every byte we could squeeze out.  the US Post
>>> Office created a standard so that all US cities (and supposedly streets)
>>> could be entered in 14 characters or less.

thinking back, I think it was 14 characters for cities and 25 for
streets.  But this IS going back 40 years.  I still have some of the 9"
tapes, but no tape drive...

>>> We changed the abbreviation
>>> of Nebraska from NB to NE (I remember writing that conversion program)
>>> so we could more easily mix US and Canada addresses (those they would
>>> not change their 6 character code to our 5 digit one).  We burned CPU to
>>> save storage. then rewrote key routines in assembler and hacked the
>>> COBOL calls to make it all work.
>>>
>>> Things change.  Design  goals change.  Systems have to change.
>> Of course they do. And those were changes in efficiency that were the
>> result of needed productivity improvements. Change for the sake of
>> major improvement(s). Wonderful, well-designed, efficient AND necessary.
>> And it obviously made things more productive for everyone!
>>
>> I argue that systemd neither improves efficiency, productivity or
>> satisfaction...nor is it necessary.
> More to the point, those 'old' efficiency hacks were from a time when
> programmer time was cheaper than the computer resources.   Now, the
> computers should be doing the work for us instead of the other way
> around.  Can anyone really make the argument that we can't afford the
> computer resources for transparent backwards compatibility now?
>

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] OT - Re: Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

mark-3
In reply to this post by Robert Moskowitz
Steve Clark wrote:

> On 07/08/2014 12:55 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
>> On 07/08/2014 12:44 PM, Hal Wigoda wrote:
>>> You aren't old.
>> And I am a young 21.  three times over.  All that means is I have to
>> learn new stuff now 3 times to get it right!  As some people on this
>> list will attest to :)
>>
>> Soon I will be 26 (2^6).  So that means that I have to then learn
>> everything 6 times!
>
> Hmm... well soon I will be 26 + 4.

Hah! Next year, I'll be 42.

      mark "in hex"

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Robert Moskowitz
In reply to this post by mark-3

On 07/08/2014 01:56 PM, [hidden email] wrote:

> Always Learning wrote:
>> On Tue, 2014-07-08 at 13:19 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
>>
>>> ROTFLMAO! And can you explain the difference between "cloud" and
>>> "time-sharing on a mainframe"?
>> 75 baud on a TTY (clank, clank, clank, ding, thud as the printer head
>> returned to the beginning of the line) and an amazingly fast speed of
>> 300 baud on the up-market Terminet (? spelling).
>>
>> Perhaps the speeds were 300 and 1,200 baud? It was a long time ago.
>>
>> Those were the days.
> I was dialing in from work to upload homework at 300 baud, around '84.
> When I got my first modem for my first real PC (we'll skip the CoCo), *I*
> had 1200 baud. *nyah*

You were late to 1200 baud.  I got one of the first Anderson/Jacobson
accoustic boxes (before they invented the accoustic coupler).  First at
300 baud, then 1200 baud on a DEC Writer II.  It was '83.  Then Bell
head said I would never get 300 baud working on a non-conditioned line...

But again that is the point.  We have moved on from there.  We got the
memories, so we know the edge cases.  Like dealing with X.75 gateways...

>
> But between 1978, when I went back to college, and '81 or os, a year into
> my first programming job, I was on punch cards; then it was the shared
> three terminals in the hall. Originally, a 370-168 timeshare, then, after
> we won the lottery to get it nine months before most everyone, we had our
> 4300. And we had *real* line printers.....
>
> But I say there *ain't* no differmenints. You'se is gots your share, we
> had VM regions.....
>
> _______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
>

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

John R Pierce
In reply to this post by Ned Slider
On 7/8/2014 6:53 AM, Ned Slider wrote:

> That's not always true.
>
> Some configs that were under /etc on el6 must now reside under /usr on el7.
>
> Take modprobe blacklists for example.
>
> On el5 and el6 they are in/etc/modprobe.d/
>
> On el7 they need to be in/usr/lib/modprobe.d/
>
> If you install modprobe blacklists to the old location under el7 they
> will not work.
>
> I'm sure there are other examples, this is just one example I've
> happened to run into.

this is insane.   traditionally in Unix-like systems, /usr is supposed
to be able to be read only and sharable between multiple systems, for
instance in NFS boot scenarios.   /var is specifically for host-specific
complex configuration and status stuff like /var/logs   /var/state  
/var/run   and so forth.



--
john r pierce                                      37N 122W
somewhere on the middle of the left coast

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

John R Pierce
In reply to this post by Always Learning-3
On 7/8/2014 10:36 AM, Always Learning wrote:
> 75 baud on a TTY (clank, clank, clank, ding, thud as the printer head
> returned to the beginning of the line) and an amazingly fast speed of
> 300 baud on the up-market Terminet (? spelling).
>
> Perhaps the speeds were 300 and 1,200 baud? It was a long time ago.

actual Teletype KSR/ASR 33 kind of machines were 110 baud (10 cps, as
they used 2 stop bits)



--
john r pierce                                      37N 122W
somewhere on the middle of the left coast

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] OT - Re: Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

mark-3
In reply to this post by mark-3
[hidden email] wrote:

> Steve Clark wrote:
>> On 07/08/2014 12:55 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
>>> On 07/08/2014 12:44 PM, Hal Wigoda wrote:
>>>> You aren't old.
>>> And I am a young 21.  three times over.  All that means is I have to
>>> learn new stuff now 3 times to get it right!  As some people on this
>>> list will attest to :)
>>>
>>> Soon I will be 26 (2^6).  So that means that I have to then learn
>>> everything 6 times!
>>
>> Hmm... well soon I will be 26 + 4.
>
> Hah! Next year, I'll be 42.
>
>       mark "in hex"

And so Officially an OF, with rights on curmudgeon

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Ned Slider
In reply to this post by Dennis Jacobfeuerborn
On 08/07/14 18:36, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:

> On 08.07.2014 15:53, Ned Slider wrote:
>> On 08/07/14 14:14, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
>>> On 08.07.2014 14:58, Adrian Sevcenco wrote:
>>>> On 07/08/2014 04:22 AM, Always Learning wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, 2014-07-07 at 20:46 -0400, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> On 07/07/2014 07:47 PM, Always Learning wrote:
>>>>>>> Reading about systemd, it seems it is not well liked and reminiscent of
>>>>>>> Microsoft's "put everything into the Windows Registry" (Win 95 onwards).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Is there a practical alternative to omnipresent, or invasive, systemd ?
>>>>>
>>>>>> So you are following the thread on the Fedora list?  I have been
>>>>>> ignoring it.
>>>>>
>>>>> No. I read some of
>>>>> http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_topic&q=systemd
>>>>>
>>>>> The systemd proponent, advocate and chief developer? wants to
>>>>> abolish /etc and /var in favour of having the /etc and /var data
>>>>> in /usr.
>>>> err.. what? even on that wild fedora thread this did not come up!!!
>>>>
>>>> i will presume that you understood well your information source and you
>>>> are actually know what you are referring to ... so, could you elaborate
>>>> more about this?(with some references)
>>>> i use systemd for some time (and i keep myslef informed about it) and i
>>>> would need to know in time about this kind of change..
>>>
>>> There are no plans to "abolish" /etc and /var.
>>>
>>> The idea is that rather than say proftpd shipping a default config file
>>> /etc/proftpd.conf that you then have to edit for you needs instead it
>>> will ship the default config somewhere in /usr and let the config in
>>> /etc override the one in /usr. That way if you want to "factory reset"
>>> the system you can basically clear out /etc and you are back do the
>>> defaults. The same applies to /var.
>>> The idea is that /etc and /var become "site-local" directories that only
>>> contain the config you actually changed from the defaults for this system.
>>>
>>> Since you already have experience with systemd you are already familiar
>>> with this system where it stores its unit files in /usr/lib/systemd and
>>> if you want to change some of them you copy them to /etc/systemd and
>>> change them there. Same principle.
>>>
>>> /etc and /var will stay as valid as ever though and are not being
>>> "abolished".
>>>
>>
>> That's not always true.
>>
>> Some configs that were under /etc on el6 must now reside under /usr on el7.
>>
>> Take modprobe blacklists for example.
>>
>> On el5 and el6 they are in /etc/modprobe.d/
>>
>> On el7 they need to be in /usr/lib/modprobe.d/
>>
>> If you install modprobe blacklists to the old location under el7 they
>> will not work.
>>
>> I'm sure there are other examples, this is just one example I've
>> happened to run into.
>
> You might want to report this as a bug. The modprobe and modprobe.d man
> pages explicitly reference "/etc/modprobe.d/*.conf" for the configuration.
>
> Regards,
>   Dennis

Well, I stand corrected!

I was just running though the issue for a reply here, and what was
broken in the rhel7rc is now fixed and indeed working as documented.

My issue looked like a regression of this bug:

https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=873220


_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Scott Robbins
In reply to this post by Gilbert Sebenste
On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 11:36:07AM -0500, Gilbert Sebenste wrote:
> On Tue, 8 Jul 2014, Lamar Owen wrote:
>
> People will vote with their feet on this. And, that "old white men" are
> complaining about this is ageist, racist, and demeaning to EVERYONE. I am
> really disappointed in Red Hat saying this, far more than the
> whole systemd concerns.


Again, let me clarify, it was a tongue-in-cheek comment made among friends,
and certainly not a RedHat official quote.

--
Scott Robbins
PGP keyID EB3467D6
( 1B48 077D 66F6 9DB0 FDC2 A409 FA54 EB34 67D6 )
gpg --keyserver pgp.mit.edu --recv-keys EB3467D6

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Richard Pierce
In reply to this post by Bruce Ferrell
I personally used a 'portable' 300-baud TI Silent 700 which printed on thermal paper and had an acoustic coupler on the side of it for those old phone handsets with the two circular cups. We dialed in and waited with great anticipation to see the next word coming from the remote machine. You also quickly learned what Ctrl-R was for due to the delete key didn't work very well‎ once the typed character was printed on thermal paper. Yes, 300 and 1200 baud were slow and taught us something about patience.

  Original Message  
From: Bruce Ferrell
Sent: Tuesday, July 8, 2014 12:57 PM
To: [hidden email]
Reply To: CentOS mailing list
Subject: Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

On 07/08/2014 10:36 AM, Always Learning wrote:

> On Tue, 2014-07-08 at 13:19 -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
>
>
>> ROTFLMAO! And can you explain the difference between "cloud" and
>> "time-sharing on a mainframe"?
> 75 baud on a TTY (clank, clank, clank, ding, thud as the printer head
> returned to the beginning of the line) and an amazingly fast speed of
> 300 baud on the up-market Terminet (? spelling).
>
> Perhaps the speeds were 300 and 1,200 baud? It was a long time ago.
>
> Those were the days.
>

110 and 300 Bps. (model 35 and 33)

75 and 50 Baud was 5 level code (model 15, 19, 28 and 32)

There was never a 1200 Bps gearset

I'm an ex teletype mechanic.... Springs, levers, cams and electromagnets. That was my door to telecom and ultimately to computers.



_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Mauricio Tavares
In reply to this post by Original Woodchuck
On Jul 8, 2014 1:48 PM, "Original Woodchuck" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 01:19:58PM -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
> > Lamar Owen wrote:
> > > On 07/08/2014 12:06 PM, Les Mikesell wrote:
> > <snip>
> > > There are alot of possibilities here, if you're willing to think
outside
> > > the 1970's timesharing minicomputer box that gave rise to the
historical
> > > Unix philosophy.  And this has nothing to do with Windows; I have
been a

> > > primarily-Linux user since 1997.
> >
> > ROTFLMAO! And can you explain the difference between "cloud" and
> > "time-sharing on a mainframe"?
> >
> >         mark
>
> Mainframes are housed in vaults with powerful airconditioners; operators
> walk around with 132-column fanfold printouts.  Operators may have
> goatees.
>
> Clouds are housed in vaults with powerful airconditioners; operators
> walk around with little gadgets.  Operators may have goatees.
>
      They prefer to be called chinbeards. ;)
> Dave
> _______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Les Mikesell
In reply to this post by John R Pierce
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 1:08 PM, John R Pierce <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 7/8/2014 6:53 AM, Ned Slider wrote:
>> That's not always true.
>>
>> Some configs that were under /etc on el6 must now reside under /usr on el7.
>>
>> Take modprobe blacklists for example.
>>
>> On el5 and el6 they are in/etc/modprobe.d/
>>
>> On el7 they need to be in/usr/lib/modprobe.d/
>>
>> If you install modprobe blacklists to the old location under el7 they
>> will not work.
>>
>> I'm sure there are other examples, this is just one example I've
>> happened to run into.
>
> this is insane.   traditionally in Unix-like systems, /usr is supposed
> to be able to be read only and sharable between multiple systems, for
> instance in NFS boot scenarios.   /var is specifically for host-specific
> complex configuration and status stuff like /var/logs   /var/state
> /var/run   and so forth.

And more to the point, /usr isn't supposed t be needed until you are
past the point of mounting all filesystems so you can boot from
something tiny.  Doesn't modprobe need its files earlier than that?

--
    Les Mikesell
       [hidden email]
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Les Mikesell
In reply to this post by Scott Robbins
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 1:12 PM, Scott Robbins <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 11:36:07AM -0500, Gilbert Sebenste wrote:
>> On Tue, 8 Jul 2014, Lamar Owen wrote:
>>
>> People will vote with their feet on this. And, that "old white men" are
>> complaining about this is ageist, racist, and demeaning to EVERYONE. I am
>> really disappointed in Red Hat saying this, far more than the
>> whole systemd concerns.
>
>
> Again, let me clarify, it was a tongue-in-cheek comment made among friends,
> and certainly not a RedHat official quote.

But aside from insulting anyone, you should think of that reference
realistically as meaning the people who have established systems
working well enough to have built businesses worth maintaining.   Do
you really want to rock that boat in favor of youngsters that don't
know how to make it work?

--
   Les Mikesell
      [hidden email]
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] OT - Re: Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Robert Moskowitz
In reply to this post by mark-3

On 07/08/2014 02:04 PM, [hidden email] wrote:

> Steve Clark wrote:
>> On 07/08/2014 12:55 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
>>> On 07/08/2014 12:44 PM, Hal Wigoda wrote:
>>>> You aren't old.
>>> And I am a young 21.  three times over.  All that means is I have to
>>> learn new stuff now 3 times to get it right!  As some people on this
>>> list will attest to :)
>>>
>>> Soon I will be 26 (2^6).  So that means that I have to then learn
>>> everything 6 times!
>> Hmm... well soon I will be 26 + 4.
> Hah! Next year, I'll be 42.
>
>        mark "in hex"

we are you as young as we base it.


_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Andrew Wyatt
In reply to this post by Scott Robbins
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 11:21 AM, Scott Robbins <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 10:27:41AM -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
> > Scott Robbins wrote:
> > > On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 02:09:49PM +0200, Dennis Jacobfeuerborn wrote:
> > >> On 08.07.2014 13:57, Scott Robbins wrote:
> >
> > >
> > > Very true. I do remember Adam Williamson of Fedora commenting on their
> > > forums that he pictured many of the complainers about various changes,
> > > including systemd, to be old white guys, which fit me to a T.
> > <snip>
> > So he's guilty of ageism, as well as aggressively NIH (Not Invented
> Here),
> > and a faddist.... Did he actually have any *good*, persuasive reasons for
> > such changes?
>
> Wow.  This was my bad in assuming everyone knows who Adam is--a very good
> natured and helpful person.  He was formerly with Mandriva, I think, and
> came to Fedora where he has made enormous strides in seeing things from the
> user standpoint, getting bugs filed, making Fedora a much better
> distribution (and better documented), than it had been.  My statement's
> implication, though of course, tongue in cheek, was that Even Adam
> thinks....
>
> So, for any friends or fans of Adam on this list, I apologize if that came
> out as a putdown or anything more than a jesting complaint.
>
>
>
>
Yeah, tongue in cheek.  Uh huh.  Sure.

"Disadvantages: people who dislike change are going to hate this one. Note
to people who dislike change: you could still remove NetworkManager
post-install if you really hate it. Having it in core doesn't preclude
that. You could also still exclude it with a kickstart. Makes the minimal
install somewhat larger." - Adam Williamson (
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=693602#c31)
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

mark-3
In reply to this post by Mauricio Tavares
Mauricio Tavares wrote:

> On Jul 8, 2014 1:48 PM, "Original Woodchuck" <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>> On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 01:19:58PM -0400, [hidden email] wrote:
>> > Lamar Owen wrote:
>> > > On 07/08/2014 12:06 PM, Les Mikesell wrote:
>> > <snip>
>> > > There are alot of possibilities here, if you're willing to think
> > > outside the 1970's timesharing minicomputer box that gave rise to the
> > > historical Unix philosophy.  And this has nothing to do with Windows; I
> > > have been a primarily-Linux user since 1997.
>> >
>> > ROTFLMAO! And can you explain the difference between "cloud" and
>> > "time-sharing on a mainframe"?
>> >
>> Mainframes are housed in vaults with powerful airconditioners; operators
>> walk around with 132-column fanfold printouts.  Operators may have
>> goatees.
>>
>> Clouds are housed in vaults with powerful airconditioners; operators
>> walk around with little gadgets.  Operators may have goatees.
>>
>       They prefer to be called chinbeards. ;)

Right. Illiterate. And they're not cool enough to wear berets, like the
gotee-wearers, back in the day....

        mark

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] OT - Re: Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Andrew Wyatt
In reply to this post by Robert Moskowitz
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 1:31 PM, Robert Moskowitz <[hidden email]>
wrote:

>
> On 07/08/2014 02:04 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
> > Steve Clark wrote:
> >> On 07/08/2014 12:55 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
> >>> On 07/08/2014 12:44 PM, Hal Wigoda wrote:
> >>>> You aren't old.
> >>> And I am a young 21.  three times over.  All that means is I have to
> >>> learn new stuff now 3 times to get it right!  As some people on this
> >>> list will attest to :)
> >>>
> >>> Soon I will be 26 (2^6).  So that means that I have to then learn
> >>> everything 6 times!
> >> Hmm... well soon I will be 26 + 4.
> > Hah! Next year, I'll be 42.
> >
> >        mark "in hex"
>
> we are you as young as we base it.
>
>
>
Geez, on that note I'm about to turn 101000!
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

John R Pierce
In reply to this post by Richard Pierce
On 7/8/2014 11:13 AM, Richard Pierce wrote:
> I personally used a 'portable' 300-baud TI Silent 700 which printed on thermal paper and had an acoustic coupler on the side of it for those old phone handsets with the two circular cups. We dialed in and waited with great anticipation to see the next word coming from the remote machine. You also quickly learned what Ctrl-R was for due to the delete key didn't work very well‎ once the typed character was printed on thermal paper. Yes, 300 and 1200 baud were slow and taught us something about patience.

in college (early 1970s) my roommate had a GE Terminet 1200 which was a
120cps printer with plain paper and a ribbon, and an integral acoustic
coupler.   this was lightyears--er--12X faster than the defacto Teletype
stuff most folks had.  But, until circa 1980, most of my actual work was
with punchcards and/or (later) direct connect VDTs at 9600 baud.   I do
still have a USR Courier 2400E somewhere in storage, which was a 2400
baud modem that had data compression and could send plain ascii at about
9600 bps, along with a couple Racal Vadic 9600-ish modems.

--
john r pierce                                      37N 122W
somewhere on the middle of the left coast

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] OT - Re: Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Mauricio Tavares
In reply to this post by Andrew Wyatt
On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 2:35 PM, Andrew Wyatt <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 8, 2014 at 1:31 PM, Robert Moskowitz <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
>>
>> On 07/08/2014 02:04 PM, [hidden email] wrote:
>> > Steve Clark wrote:
>> >> On 07/08/2014 12:55 PM, Robert Moskowitz wrote:
>> >>> On 07/08/2014 12:44 PM, Hal Wigoda wrote:
>> >>>> You aren't old.
>> >>> And I am a young 21.  three times over.  All that means is I have to
>> >>> learn new stuff now 3 times to get it right!  As some people on this
>> >>> list will attest to :)
>> >>>
>> >>> Soon I will be 26 (2^6).  So that means that I have to then learn
>> >>> everything 6 times!
>> >> Hmm... well soon I will be 26 + 4.
>> > Hah! Next year, I'll be 42.
>> >
>> >        mark "in hex"
>>
>> we are you as young as we base it.
>>
>>
>>
> Geez, on that note I'm about to turn 101000!

      As Fry told Bender, there is no 2.

> _______________________________________________
> CentOS mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

Jonathan Billings
In reply to this post by Les Mikesell
On Tue, Jul 08, 2014 at 01:22:54PM -0500, Les Mikesell wrote:
> And more to the point, /usr isn't supposed t be needed until you are
> past the point of mounting all filesystems so you can boot from
> something tiny.  Doesn't modprobe need its files earlier than that?

I think that a lot of these objections are addressed here:

http://www.freedesktop.org/wiki/Software/systemd/separate-usr-is-broken/

--
Jonathan Billings <[hidden email]>
_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [CentOS] Cemtos 7 : Systemd alternatives ?

mark-3
In reply to this post by John R Pierce
John R Pierce wrote:
> On 7/8/2014 11:13 AM, Richard Pierce wrote:
<snip>
> stuff most folks had.  But, until circa 1980, most of my actual work was
> with punchcards and/or (later) direct connect VDTs at 9600 baud.   I do
> still have a USR Courier 2400E somewhere in storage, which was a 2400
> baud modem that had data compression and could send plain ascii at about
> 9600 bps, along with a couple Racal Vadic 9600-ish modems.
>
I think I still have my 56k modem. Unfortunately, I also think it's ISA....

       mark

_______________________________________________
CentOS mailing list
[hidden email]
http://lists.centos.org/mailman/listinfo/centos
12345678 ... 13